ORAL QUESTIONS

QUESTIONS TO MINISTERS

Question No. 1—Prime Minister

1. Hon SIMON BRIDGES (Leader—National) to the Prime Minister: Does she have confidence in all her Ministers?

Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN (Prime Minister): Malo e laumalie. Yes.

Hon Simon Bridges: When was she or her office first advised that there was a staffing matter in the Hon Meka Whaitiri's office requiring an investigation by Ministerial Services?

Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: As I have said, I do want to keep the detail of this issue with Ministerial Services where it belongs, as an employment matter, though I can say that I was informed—my recollection was last Wednesday night, if my memory serves best—and, of course, within a 24-hour period the Minister offered up to stand aside while the investigation took place.

Hon Simon Bridges: Who told her on Wednesday night? Was it the Minister herself or someone else, and, if so, who?

Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: I don't want to get into the details of something that is being inquired into by Ministerial Services. That is the best place for this investigation to take place. It is entirely appropriate that that is how it is dealt with.

Hon Simon Bridges: Did the Minister tell the Prime Minister?

Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: I've made it clear that, obviously, I've had a conversation with the Minister directly about it. She has said she wants this dealt with openly and transparently. That is what we're doing. That is why she offered up to stand aside while this was dealt with. But it is being dealt with by Ministerial Services, and that's the best place for it to be dealt with. If the Opposition leader has a range of specific questions around dates and times, he's most welcome to put those in writing.

Hon Simon Bridges: Well, was it the Minister that told the Prime Minister, or was it someone else?

Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: This is an issue that is being dealt with, rightly so, by Ministerial Services. That is the best place for it to be dealt with. I believe in natural justice. I also want to protect the privacy of individuals who are involved, and that's why we're dealing with it in the most appropriate way possible.

Hon Simon Bridges: Did she ask the Hon Meka Whaitiri directly what happened?

Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: It is fair to say that the allegation is contested, which is why it's being dealt with by Ministerial Services, and that is appropriate.

Hon Simon Bridges: Does she stand by her reported statements that Labour monitored staff turnover in its Ministers' offices; if so, how is this monitoring undertaken?

Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: As would be the case for the member when he was in office, obviously, Ministerial Services are aware of staff turnover and the different circumstances that lead to staff turnover. When in Opposition, then it's Parliamentary Service that plays that role.

Hon Simon Bridges: How will her Government foster a more open and democratic society, as outlined in the Speech from the Throne, when she has had to demote her Minister for open government for not being open and transparent in her answers to written questions?

Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: That is exactly why the Minister has had to bear the brunt of the consequences of not upholding her own standards. And, on her own measure, she has acknowledged that those errors led to a perception that she wasn't open in her actions, which is why she absolutely accepted and offered up the role of open Government.

Hon Simon Bridges: Did she ask Clare Curran why she had not noted her meeting with Derek Handley in her diary, considering that just one week prior to that meeting she'd been asked an oral question in the House about her failure to record her breakfast meeting with Carol Hirschfeld?

Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: I've been asked this question via the media and have given the same answer I'm happy to give to the House. The member, of course, recalls the meeting she had. It wasn't recorded, and that's something that she acknowledges was a complete error. It was set up via herself, and she has released all of the documentation surrounding that meeting and the establishment of that meeting to make it clear what happened in the lead-up to those events.

Hon Simon Bridges: Has she or her office sought an undertaking from the Hon Clare Curran that she has now transferred all appropriate records from her private Gmail account to her ministerial email accounts so that they can be searched for official information and to ensure that appropriate public records are maintained?

Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: As the member will know, the Official Information Act (OIA) is mode neutral. Regardless of whether or not information is held on a Gmail account or a parliamentary account, it is subject to the Official Information Act. That is the key. The member, though, proactively, when this issue came out, released a number of different pieces of information relating to this particular incident in order to be transparent around what happened. But it's OIA-able.

Hon Simon Bridges: Does she agree with Bryce Edwards' comments that the same mistake by the same person, leading to the same serious outcome—misleading Parliament within a few months—is corrosive; and, if not, why not?

Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: I do not.

Hon Simon Bridges: Was David Cormack correct in his New Zealand Herald column on 27 August when he said the Department of Internal Affairs told the Prime Minister's office about Clare Curran's meeting with Derek Handley, and how does this square with her press conference on 24 August when she said Minister Clare Curran's office alerted her office about the meeting?

Rt Hon JACINDA ARDERN: That is the case. I was alerted by Minister Curran's office.

• Question No. 2—Infrastructure
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2. CLAYTON MITCHELL (NZ First) to the Minister for Infrastructure: What announcements has he made recently?

Hon SHANE JONES (Minister for Infrastructure): Recently, at the Building Nations Symposium in Auckland, Cabinet mandated me to announce the establishment of a new independent entity. It has taken not longer than nine months to have this entity well on the way to being erected, unlike the nine years where the industry called for it. The level of confidence reflected back to me through this decision reflects very well on the Government's approach to infrastructure.

Clayton Mitchell: How will the new entity deliver longer-term infrastructure planning and strategy?

Hon SHANE JONES: When we came into Government, we discovered very quickly and very lucidly that there is a major infrastructure deficit. There is a desire on the part of the industry for us to create a portal: a clear point of visibility to enable international, domestic, trans-Tasman providers of either capital, construction services, or other professional services to work with the Crown so we can begin to deal more efficiently with the large infrastructure investment—

Hon Gerry Brownlee: "Blah-blah, blah-blah, blah-blah."

Hon SHANE JONES: Yes, Gerry, how is the "Pink Panther" going? Thank you very much.

SPEAKER: Order!

Clayton Mitchell: Nice. Thank you—

SPEAKER: Order! No, the member will resume his seat. The last comment, in two ways, was inappropriate. The member will withdraw and apologise.

Hon SHANE JONES: I withdraw and apologise.

Clayton Mitchell: What feedback did the announcement receive from the private sector?

Hon SHANE JONES: Infrastructure New Zealand described it as "positive news", "a major step forward for the Government", an acceptance that there is a wide number of challenges, and, through the creation of this independent agency, at long last they see a Government that is willing to engage with them so that we get the right balance between our political aspirations and harnessing the talent of the private sector and the public sector to deliver infrastructure outcomes in a way that has not been delivered, certainly over the last nine years. Kim Campbell, an occasional critic of the Government—forgiven on this particular occasion—described it as the creation of an entity with a "mandate to pull together the long-term pipeline of our infrastructure needs.", and I would just say that what I've done in nine months failed to come into being over nine years.

• Question No. 3—Finance
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3. Hon AMY ADAMS (National—Selwyn) to the Minister of Finance: Does he think it reflects well on the Government's economic management that the ANZ business confidence index is at its lowest level since 2008 and the ANZ own activity index is at its lowest level since 2009?

Hon GRANT ROBERTSON (Minister of Finance): Malo e laumalie. It is a reflection of the Government's economic management that we have a strong surplus, net core Crown debt is low, unemployment is low, and, as at yesterday, our annual terms of trade are the best they have been since records began, in 1926. The business confidence survey the member refers to is a reflection of a range of factors including global trends, skills shortages, and business-specific policy issues, all of which we are committed to working with business on.

Hon Amy Adams: Does he acknowledge that the sharp declines in business investment intentions, export intentions, and hiring intentions seen in the most recent survey provide a clear indicator of further slowing in our economy, as noted by the ANZ?

Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: No, I don't accept that, and indeed the terms of trade numbers yesterday make clear that—particularly around exports—that's not the case.

Hon Amy Adams: Is he aware that one of the only measures in these business confidence surveys that has remained positive since the Government has come into office is the number of businesses who expect to be raising their prices?

Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: I note that in this survey, 76 percent of businesses expected their own activity to improve or remain the same over the next year, which I think is a slight tick up.

Hon Amy Adams: How will the Government's recently announced Business Partnership Agenda give hard-working small businesses confidence and the certainty the Prime Minister promised them when 15 of the 26 policies in that document are working groups with uncertain outcomes?

Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: Well, the small business sector can have confidence that we're introducing e-invoicing and closing loopholes around GST, and there is just a small irony in the member's question in that the one thing her leader decided to do was set up a working group on small business.

Hon Amy Adams: Does it reflect well on the economic management of the Government that the New Zealand Institute of Economic Research's (NZIER's) latest forecasts have the New Zealand economy $9 billion smaller in 2022 than was forecast just three months ago, and will he take any responsibility for this?

Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: I certainly won't take responsibility for NZIER's forecasts and the fact that they've chosen to revise them. What I would say is that most forecasters still believe that we will have 3 percent growth on average over the next few years.

Hon Amy Adams: Does it speak well of the Government's economic management that the Minister ignored Treasury advice when he decided to move $6 billion of debt to Crown entities in Budget 2018, costing taxpayers tens of millions more in unnecessary interest costs, simply to give the illusion of meeting his own Budget responsibility rules?

Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: I can quote no better expert on this than a former associate finance Minister who, when exactly the same facility was introduced, said "we believe that external financing will deliver additional commercial discipline for Housing New Zealand." I agree with Amy Adams about that.

• Question No. 4—Finance
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4. TAMATI COFFEY (Labour—Waiariki) to the Minister of Finance: What recent reports has he seen on the New Zealand economy?

Hon GRANT ROBERTSON (Minister of Finance): More good news. Yesterday, Statistics New Zealand released the terms-of-trade figures for the June 2018 quarter, showing the strength of New Zealand's export prices over what we pay for imports. Strong readings for dairy and meat export prices led the way for a 0.6 percent quarterly rise in New Zealand's terms of trade to the second-highest quarterly reading and the highest ever annual terms-of-trade index since records began in 1926.

Tamati Coffey: What else did Statistics New Zealand say about the terms of trade and the New Zealand economy?

Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: Statistics New Zealands says that the terms of trade are an indicator of the state of the overall economy. The quarter's figures show that exports were strong off the back of a lift in dairy and meat prices. The terms of trade data also shows that capital goods import volumes are up 13 percent from the previous quarter and up nearly 25 percent from a year ago. These are goods like new machinery, industrial and transport equipment, which businesses invest in to improve productivity and to drive growth. ASB economists said that the terms-of-trade data showed capital goods import volumes were resilient in the June quarter. On this side of the House, we welcome the fact that real economic data shows that there is confidence among businesses to make productivity-enhancing investments.

Tamati Coffey: How does this fit with other reports he's seen on the economy and business performance?

Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: Over August, we saw the earnings season on the New Zealand stock exchange. There were too many reports of companies reporting record revenue or profit results for me to list them all in the House today, but I will note that the NZX 50 finished the month up about 4 percent from where it started, with the stock exchange hitting a record high during August, off the back of companies earning reports. One other report which the House may find interesting is Treasury's monthly economic indicators released yesterday, and I draw members' attention to the line that "Overall our [Budget and Economic Fiscal Update] pick of 0.7% GDP growth in the June quarter is unchanged." In other words, the sky is not falling in.

Hon Amy Adams: Would the Minister agree that, given the record terms of trade he's just espoused, the fact that our economic growth is slowing and that export intentions are down can only be laid at the feet of this Government's economic mismanagement?

Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: No, because the member clearly wasn't listening to my very last comment, which is Treasury picking that their GDP growth forecast for the June quarter is unchanged.

David Seymour: Well, what is the definition of "terms of trade"?

Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: I think I helpfully said that at the beginning. It's the strength of New Zealand's export prices over what we pay for imports.

David Seymour: So how does the New Zealand Government change those global prices?

Hon GRANT ROBERTSON: Working with hard-working business people around New Zealand, it's about encouraging an economy that focuses on productivity, supporting exporters through investment in transport infrastructure, in skills and training, in research and development—the things that for nine years were ignored but now exporters in New Zealand know they have a friend in the Government.

• Question No. 5—Housing and Urban Development
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5. Hon JUDITH COLLINS (National—Papakura) to the Minister of Housing and Urban Development: Does he stand by all his reported statements regarding the establishment of an Urban Development Authority?

Hon PHIL TWYFORD (Minister of Housing and Urban Development): Malo e laumalie, Mr Speaker. Yes, in the context in which they were made.

Hon Judith Collins: What is the budget for the establishment and ongoing costs of the urban development authority?

Hon PHIL TWYFORD: The policy process is not even complete. The legislation is not before the House. There is currently no budget for the urban development authority.

Hon Judith Collins: Was he expecting to recoup the cost of the urban development authority from the Auckland Council when he said it will become "the planning and consenting authority" and "have access to all the planning and consenting powers" currently held by the council?

Hon PHIL TWYFORD: The planned urban development authority is a new way of planning large-scale and complex urban development projects. The entity is expected to be established towards the end of next year, and the Government's plan is that the urban development authority will lead and facilitate the establishment of 12 to 15 large-scale projects—projects that are capable of delivering thousands of new homes and planned new communities. The authority will have the planning and consenting powers that currently only local government has, but those powers will be exercised only in discrete project areas. It is not intended that it will be a rival or competitive consenting authority across the entire country.

SPEAKER: Order! I am going to ask the member, Judith Collins, to ask the question again.

Hon Judith Collins: Was he expecting to recoup the cost of the urban development authority from the Auckland Council when he said it will become "the planning and consenting authority" and "have access to all the planning and consenting powers" currently held by the council?

Hon PHIL TWYFORD: No.

Hon Judith Collins: If the urban development authority is to become the "planning and consenting authority" for KiwiBuild developments, why should mum and dad developers still be expected to endure the delays currently expected from the Auckland Council?

Hon PHIL TWYFORD: They won't, because this Government has a complex and ambitious urban growth agenda that is designed to tackle all of the problems and the roadblocks in the consenting system; the way that our planning system stops our towns and cities from growing; and the way that the infrastructure financing system is broken and acts as a roadblock to urban growth. So there is a whole reform agenda designed to tackle the problems that the current planning and consenting system put in the way of all developers, not just mum and dad developers.

Hon Judith Collins: If, as he has said, the urban development authority will "be able to override [Auckland Council's] Unitary Plan", why should every other Aucklander have to comply with it?

Hon PHIL TWYFORD: Because this Government recognises we have an imperative that in our country's largest city we have to build more houses, we have to undertake high-quality, master-planned, large-scale development. We need an entity to do that because the current institutions and policy settings have singularly failed to deliver. We have that ambition, and I guess we probably shared it with the last Government because they spent 12 months consulting with the public on the proposal for an urban development authority.

Marja Lubeck: Malo e laumalie, Mr Speaker. Why is the Government establishing an urban development authority?

Hon PHIL TWYFORD: Because, traditionally, New Zealand's towns and cities have grown simply by turning neighbouring rural land into suburban homes. Brownfield development in cities is more difficult and risky because of poor quality infrastructure and disparate landowners. The urban development authority is a new way of planning these large-scale developments. It will be a one-stop shop for all the development capability this Government needs to build our way out of the national housing crisis.

Marja Lubeck: What is the Government doing to free up land and enable development?

Hon PHIL TWYFORD: The Government has an ambitious plan to create the conditions so that the market can respond to growth and bring down the high cost of urban land. The main objective of our urban growth agenda is to improve housing affordability, encourage more competitive urban land markets, and improve housing affordability. The three key areas are infrastructure funding and financing, to enable a more responsive supply of infrastructure finance; urban planning that allows our cities to grow up and out while delivering a quality built environment; and, thirdly, a stronger spatial planning partnership so that central government and local government can plan together for growth.

Hon Judith Collins: Will he support substantive reform of the Resource Management Act (RMA) to enable housing and urban development to proceed efficiently for all New Zealanders?

Hon PHIL TWYFORD: Well, if the National Party's offering a bipartisan opportunity to support reforms to the planning system that genuinely encourage more urban growth and more affordable housing, our side of the House would support that. But what we saw for nine years from that side of the House was ham-fisted attempts to gut the RMA of its environmental protections and a series of reforms that only succeeded in making the RMA more expensive and more complicated.

• Question No. 6—Housing and Urban Development
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6. ANAHILA KANONGATA'A-SUISUIKI (Labour) to the Minister of Housing and Urban Development: What steps, if any, has the Government taken to ensure families who are renting their homes have secure, stable, warm, and dry homes?

Hon PHIL TWYFORD (Minister of Housing and Urban Development): This Government is fulfilling our commitment to make life better for renters. Last week, the Government asked for feedback on our proposed changes to the Residential Tenancies Act. Tenancy laws are antiquated and don't reflect the fact that renting is now a long-term reality for so many families. This morning, I announced our proposed healthy homes guarantee standards. The standards will set minimum requirements for heating, insulation, ventilation, moisture and drainage, and draught-stopping in all rental properties.

Anahila Kanongata'a-Suisuiki: What effect will the Government's proposed changes to the Residential Tenancies Act have on families?

Hon PHIL TWYFORD: Well, insecure tenure can force families to continually move house, which is particularly tough on children when they have to keep changing schools. By ending no-cause tenancy terminations while ensuring that landlords can still get rid of rogue tenants, and increasing the amount of notice a landlord must give to tenants to terminate a tenancy, we can give families a more stable home and more secure tenure. We're also consulting on limiting rent increases to once per year, banning rent bidding, and working out how we can better enable tenants and landlords to reach agreement about pets and minor alterations to their home.

Anahila Kanongata'a-Suisuiki: How will the healthy homes standards ensure families have warm and dry homes?

Hon PHIL TWYFORD: Well, we know that rental homes are more likely to be older and of poorer quality than owner-occupied homes. Approximately 200,000, or more than a third, of rental homes have no installation at all. Many are cold and damp and mouldy and cause respiratory illness, toxic reactions, and allergies. In fact, some 40,000 children go to hospital every year with respiratory infections caused by illnesses related to poor-quality housing.

Anahila Kanongata'a-Suisuiki: What reports has he seen on the need for these reforms?

Hon PHIL TWYFORD: On almost a daily basis, we see stories of tenants in homes of unacceptable quality or being moved on from home after home. One tenant speaking to Radio New Zealand recently had moved between six different homes, including spending a week in a basement, and recently the New Zealand Herald reported on the Papakura "swamp house", where a family with two young children were permanently sick because of a rubbish-filled pond under their house.

• Question No. 7—Transport
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7. JAMI-LEE ROSS (National—Botany) to the Minister of Transport: Does the National Land Transport Programme announced last week give New Zealand road users good value for the road-user charges and fuel taxes they are paying?

Hon PHIL TWYFORD (Minister of Transport): Yes. The National Land Transport Programme is a record investment in our transport system, including a 37 percent increase in road safety spending to save lives; a $600 million increase in road funding to the regions; $5.7 billion for State highways, including Pūhoi to Wellsford, Mount Messenger, the Manawatū Gorge replacement, and Transmission Gully; and $4 billion to ease congestion in our major cities.

Jami-Lee Ross: How is it good value for people in Tauranga to pay 12c more in fuel taxes, but not receive the much-needed four-laning of State Highway 2—New Zealand's deadliest road?

Hon PHIL TWYFORD: Well, I'm sure the member knows that that road suffered from terrible neglect over nine years. This Government is undertaking—through the New Zealand Transport Agency—a re-evaluation of the plans for that highway, but we recognise that it's not good enough that nothing was done to that road while suburbs were allowed to expand along that corridor towards Ōmokoroa. It needs investment in safety improvements, and, under this Government, it'll get them.

Jami-Lee Ross: How is it good value for the people of Ōtaki to pay 12c a litre more in fuel taxes, when they're less likely to get the Ōtaki to Levin expressway completed, as the Prime Minister actually promised in the media?

Hon PHIL TWYFORD: Well, the people of Ōtaki and Levin, like communities all over this country, are going to benefit from a more rational and measured transport policy that invests in safety improvements: passing lanes, median barriers, side barriers, intersection upgrades, because we're concerned to improve safety and save lives across thousands of kilometres of the transport network, not just a few dozen kilometres, which was the policy of the former Government.

Jami-Lee Ross: Will the tram projects in Auckland that he's been championing be funded from revenue gained from fuel taxes?

Hon PHIL TWYFORD: Well, the light rail rapid transit project in Auckland will not be funded through the regional fuel tax as the member has consistently claimed through the media. But $1.8 billion has been set aside as part of the $28 billion 10-year transport investment plan that this Government put together in cooperation with Auckland Council—the first time there has ever been a fully funded 10-year transport plan for Auckland.

Jami-Lee Ross: Why should people in Tauranga and Ōtaki pay 12c a litre more in fuel taxes to fund Auckland trams, when his Government won't commit to funding the much-needed roads in those communities?

Hon PHIL TWYFORD: No amount of baseless scaremongering from the member can change that fact that, under our transport plan, we're putting $600 million more into roading in the regions than is going into the six biggest metropolitan centres—a bigger increase than we ever saw under the former Government.

• Question No. 8—Health
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8. Hon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE (National) to the Minister of Health: Does he believe he has followed the process set out in the State Services Commission document Board Appointment and Induction Guidelines in making appointments to health sector entities?

Hon Dr DAVID CLARK (Minister of Health): Malo e laumalie, Eiki Sea. According to the State services guidelines, Ministers may appoint or recommend those who, in their opinion, have the appropriate knowledge, skills, and experience to assist the entity to achieve its objectives and perform its function. My answer is yes.

Hon Michael Woodhouse: How many of the 15 steps recommended by those guidelines were not followed in the appointment of the Hon Steve Maharey to chair the board of Pharmac?

Hon Dr DAVID CLARK: Steve Maharey's appointment followed the standard process for board chairs and was signed off by Cabinet.

Hon Michael Woodhouse: How could best practice process have been followed in the appointment of the Hon Mark Gosche to chair the Counties Manukau District Health Board when the decision to appoint him was made prior to the formal decision to remove Rabin Rabindran and before the recommendation to appoint Mr Gosche was put before the appropriate Cabinet committee?

Hon Dr DAVID CLARK: I reject some of the assertions made in that statement, but suffice to say that Ministers may appoint or recommend those who have the appropriate knowledge, skills, and experience to assist the entity to achieve its objects and performance function. When I have good candidates, I'm willing to guide an appointment process that appoints them, and I've appointed dozens of board members since I became the Minister of Health and I stand by the appointments that I've made.

Hon Michael Woodhouse: Do those appropriate skills and attributes include being former Ministers of the Labour Government?

Hon Dr DAVID CLARK: Being a Minister of the Crown is a good qualification when it comes to skills and experience pointed to in the Board Appointment and Induction Guidelines from the State Services Commission. They indicate that skills and experience are very important, so Ministers of the Crown do have qualifications that can be useful for these appointments. As I say, I've made dozens of them, and a few of them have been former Crown Ministers.

Hon Michael Woodhouse: Isn't this just a clear pattern—those appointments, plus those of the Hon Pete Hodgson, Margaret Wilson, and Heather Simpson—of jobs for former Labour Ministers and a long-time Labour staffer being offered without even a basic nod to the very probity to which he claims to subscribe?

Hon Dr DAVID CLARK: No.

• Question No. 9—Greater Christchurch Regeneration
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9. Hon RUTH DYSON (Labour—Port Hills) to the Minister for Greater Christchurch Regeneration: What progress, if any, has this Government made towards the regeneration of Greater Christchurch?

Hon Dr MEGAN WOODS (Minister for Greater Christchurch Regeneration): Malo e laumalie, 'Eiki Sea. As this House will know, today is the eighth anniversary of the September earthquake that disrupted so many people's lives. Since coming to office, this Government has worked hard to remove remaining roadblocks by, among other things, putting mental health support workers into our primary schools, reforming the Earthquake Commission (EQC) and accelerating the resolution of outstanding claims, and putting stalled anchor projects back on track while setting up a $300 million capital fund to finish the job. We're also establishing an insurance tribunal, with legislation which my colleague, Andrew Little, will bring to the House this afternoon.

Hon Ruth Dyson:

[Tongan text to be inserted by the Hansard Office.]

Why is it important that the Government continues to prioritise the regeneration of Christchurch?

Hon Dr MEGAN WOODS: It's important because there's still unfinished business in Christchurch. People are still living in damaged homes, families are still coping with serious psychosocial impacts, and businesses are waiting for certainty. This Government is committed to finishing the job and helping people move on with their lives.

Hon Ruth Dyson: What further progress does she anticipate in the coming months?

Hon Dr MEGAN WOODS: There are a range of things we can expect to see over the coming months. Some include a global settlement with Christchurch City Council, more initiatives to speed up the resolution of the remaining insurance claims, an inquiry into EQC, and the development of a business case for a stadium enabled by the establishment by this Government of a capital acceleration fund.

• Question No. 10—Small Business
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10. Hon JACQUI DEAN (National—Waitaki) to the Minister for Small Business: Does he stand by all his statements and actions regarding small business?

Hon STUART NASH (Minister for Small Business): Malo e lelei 'Eiki Sea. Yes, in context.

Hon Jacqui Dean: What is the difference between the Small Business Council he announced three weeks ago and the Prime Minister's Business Advisory Council, announced by the Prime Minister last week?

Hon STUART NASH: One is about small businesses and driving growth in productivity across that sector; the other is to give the Prime Minister advice.

Hon Jacqui Dean: What is the difference between the Small Business Council's role, which is to "build relationships with small businesses … and be the voice of small business at the Cabinet table", and the Prime Minister's Business Advisory Council's role, which is, "I want to work closely with and be advised by senior business leaders"?

Hon STUART NASH: I repeat, one is to drive productivity and growth across the small business sector; the other is to give the Prime Minister advice.

Hon Jacqui Dean: Will the proposed small-business institute, to be located at a New Zealand university, have similar terms of reference, which will take the count to three new advisory groups?

Hon STUART NASH: Wait and see.

Hon Jacqui Dean: If business confidence continues to fall, will he go on to establish a small-business commission?

Hon STUART NASH: It's quite interesting. The managing director of Xero, which provides services to over 300,000 small businesses, actually says their own survey of business indicators challenges the notion that the economy is in a downturn. But one thing I would say is that that former Minister actually put the Small Business Advisory Group into abeyance, so that for the first time in 15 years a Minister for Small Business had no voice around the table. She stopped listening.

Hon Gerry Brownlee: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. That can't possibly be accepted as a reasonable answer to the very simple question that was asked about what he would do. He said all sorts of things that are perhaps interesting to him but were in no way an answer to the question.

SPEAKER: Well, it certainly wasn't a helpful answer, but I think it's also fair to say that a part of the question headed away from that member's area of responsibility. I don't think he has a general responsibility for business confidence.

• Question No. 11—Employment
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11. Hon PAULA BENNETT (Deputy Leader—National) to the Minister of Employment: Was the unemployment rate 4.9 percent when he was sworn in as Minister, as he stated on Newshub Nation on Saturday, 1 September?

Hon WILLIE JACKSON (Minister of Employment): Malo e leilei, Mr Speaker. I thank the member for the question. I was happily mistaken when I said it was 4.9 percent, on Newshub Nation. I've now been advised that at the time I was sworn in as the Minister of Employment the official annual rate for unemployment was actually 5 percent.

Hon Paula Bennett: Is the Minister certain that the unemployment rate when he was sworn in was at—what did he just say?—5 percent and not actually at 4.6 percent?

Hon WILLIE JACKSON: I'm actually absolutely certain that the annual rate was 5 percent. What the member needs to understand is that there are annual rates and there are quarterly rates. It's easy to cherry-pick figures to suit the narrative. But you cannot argue: since this Government came into office, the official annual rate of unemployment has dropped from 5 percent in June 2017 to 4.5 percent in June 2018.

Hon Paula Bennett: So can we expect the Minister to continue cherry-picking numbers, as he put it, instead of putting the actual facts on the table and being across his portfolio?

Hon WILLIE JACKSON: That's a sad question. I'm absolutely across this portfolio. We're putting in a lot of investment. We shouldn't get caught up in the 0.1, 0.2, 0.3; it's about the people—the people, sadly, that the Opposition forgot all about: the member Bennett, the member Goldsmith, and all the members on the opposite side—

SPEAKER: Order! Order! That's enough. The member will resume his seat.

Hon Paula Bennett: So when he said he had taken the number of NEETs—those not in employment, education, or training—from 80,000 down to 72,000, did he know it was actually 76,000 when he came into office, increasing, of course, to 83,000 in March this year, and, if so, does he know what the number is now?

Hon WILLIE JACKSON: Here we go again, talking about the figures. We're very clear that the latest survey has been the best survey for a number of years. We have more Māori being employed, we have more women being employed, and the NEETs have gone down much more than it ever did with the Opposition.

Jamie Strange: Malo e laumalie. What other statistics did the Minister discuss on Newshub Nation, on Saturday, 1 September?

Hon WILLIE JACKSON: What a great question. I discussed the unemployment rates of Māori, of Pasifika, and of young people not engaged in education, employment, or training as well, and I'm proud to share that with the House today. This Government is making a difference for the key groups. Māori unemployment is now 9.4 percent, down from 11.1 this time last year, and the Māori employment rate is up to 63.9 percent from 61.3 percent. Pasifika unemployment is now 8.6 percent, down from 10.2 percent in the same period, and the employment rate is now up to 60.9 percent. The NEETs rate is now 10.9 percent, down from 11.2 percent. This Government is on track. We've made a great start, but there's still much to do, and we're more than willing to get on with the job.

Jamie Strange: What else did the excellent Minister discuss on Newshub Nation about—

SPEAKER: Order! Order! The member just lost his question.

Hon Paula Bennett: What is the current number of NEETs?

Hon WILLIE JACKSON: The NEETs figure is down to 72 percent.

• Question No. 12—Small Business
•
12. JO LUXTON (Labour) to the Minister for Small Business: What initiatives has he recently announced to support small businesses?

Hon STUART NASH (Minister for Small Business): Malo e lelei, Eiki Sea. Last month, this Government announced the creation of the Small Business Council to work on initiatives and strategic issues to help drive improvement and innovation in the small-business sector. This builds on top of other initiatives in the previous quarter, including 12 successful small business roadshows around the country, Budget 2018 initiatives that actually funded the invoicing, and the development of online tools such as the health and safety policymaker to modernise and simplify the way we support business.

Jo Luxton: What feedback has the Minister received from small businesses about these initiatives?

Hon STUART NASH: More than 1,000 small-business owners or aspiring owners have recently taken part in a three-month series of roadshows around the country. A survey of the sentiment showed that they were positive about the services and support that the Government agencies offer small businesses. Eighty-one percent also described the roadshows as excellent or very good, and each day there are between 5,000 and 10,000 Kiwi businesses visiting business.gov.nz. The average visitor satisfaction rating is 84 percent.

Jo Luxton: How did the Minister decide on the membership of the Small Business Council?

Hon STUART NASH: Alongside small-business owners, I deliberately included the so-called "big end" of town, such as the New Zealand Bankers' Association, Fonterra, and Xero, as members on my Small Business Council. Access to capital, accounting, and payments software, new digital tools, and prompt payment are some of the frequent topics that small businesses raise with me, and the need for the support of other businesses in order to thrive. And small businesses and large corporates need to work together and ensure that the needs of the small and medium sized enterprise sector are supported. I'm committed to supporting small businesses to that effect.

• Question No. 11 to Minister—Amended Answer
•
Hon WILLIE JACKSON (Minister of Employment): Mr Speaker, I just wanted to correct something that I said in the answer.

SPEAKER: Order! The member's going to seek leave.

Hon WILLIE JACKSON: Can I seek leave to make a correction?

SPEAKER: Is there any objection? The Hon Willie Jackson.

Hon WILLIE JACKSON: Thank you, Mr Speaker. Sadly, I've made a mistake over the 80 percent to 72 percent young people not in education, employment, or training. I meant 80,000 to 72,000. Thank you.

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